Posted tagged ‘Carlos Mencia’

And another thing…..

March 30, 2008

A couple more quick notes:

I got an email today that feels a little less-than-fresh. The “joke thief” charge is being thrown around again, and the evidence seems a bit strained to me.

I enjoy watching Real Time with Bill Maher on HBO, and usually TiVo it so I can watch it more than once. Oftentimes the guests are really astute and have some very nuanced arguments that I like to mull over. I don’t get a whole lot of belly laughs out of it, though now and again someone will say something really funny. As I noted earlier, Maher is much better now that his writers are back (I’m especially a fan of Chris Kelly).

Daryl Cagle is a political cartoonist who runs a site called The Cagle Post. It aggregates some of the best political cartoons from across the U.S. and around the world, and adds columns from noted pundits (though it seems to me that the roster of talent… and Jonah Goldberg… skews a bit to the right). It’s nice to be reminded that there are some very clever people making interesting and salient points in a 3″x 3″ square.

Today’s message was blunt and provocative:

The columnists and cartoonists have been focusing on Hillary Clinton’s goofy claims to have dodged sniper fire on a visit to Bosnia with her daughter, Chelsea and comedian, Sinbad. As he often does, comedian Bill Maher stole from the week’s political cartoons for his monologue, including the Bagley cartoon at the right, for his joke about Hillary claiming to raise the flag at Iwo Jima. […] Visit our site each week and you can write a TV show just like Bill Maher!

That’s a pretty strong accusation. But I don’t know that it’s appropriately placed. Topical humor leads to a lot of parallel thinking. There’s no shortage of political cartoons, for instance, that use similar imagery on a specific issue. Recall last summer, when Barry Bonds was chasing the Major League home run record. How many cartoons did you see with him using a syringe as a bat, or with an asterisk on his jersey instead of a number? Were all of those cartoonists stealing the idea of the first one who thought of it?

Cagle’s assumption that Maher’s writers went to Cagle’s site to get at the Pat Buchanan column strikes me as a bit self-serving. I suspect that Maher’s writers read Buchanan and his ilk the same way entertainment reporters read Variety. There’s going to be something in there you can use.

Of course, I don’t know the whole story, so I’m not trying to cast any aspersions. Could be that Cagle’s been tracking the jokes on Real Time for a while, and finally had enough. At least one comedy writer/blogger of my acquaintance has seen some jokes on Real Time that seemed… shall we say, familiar?… to ones they had written on their blog.

But suspicion is not evidence.

I understand that people can be very possessive of their ideas, often for good reason. I used to work with Gary Huck, a very funny and dedicated cartoonist who works out of Pittsburgh with the United Electrical, Radio & Machine Workers of America (UE). He labored mightily over each of his cartoons, and made my workday go by a bit quicker with his quick wit. He had a long-standing issue with people stealing one of his ideas in particular. You might recognize it:

Gary wasn’t concerned about sharing the idea. He was bothered by people stealing it. Usually, if some labor or political group wanted to use his work, he’d let them have it for free, or for a nominal charge. But when someone took it without asking, he had little patience. Justifiably so.

But not every idea is a singular act of artistry. Sometimes the idea is not especially unique, and more than one person comes up with it. With the Carlos Mencia and Dane Cook accusations spreading beyond the insular world of comics into the public consciousness, it might be that people are getting a little too sensitive, or perhaps a little too eager to cry foul.

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Didn’t they learn anything from Fox News?

After the embarrassing debacle that was The Half-Hour News Hour (see my review here), you’d think that “real” news people would have the good sense to leave comedy to the professionals. But apparently not.

CNN announced this week that CNN Headline News is starting a comedy show next weekend. (Preview it here.) Variety reports, “The first episode will feature commentators including Time.com’s Washington editor Ana Marie Cox, L.A. Times columnist Joel Stein, Republican strategist Amy Holmes, Huffington Post media editor Rachel Sklar and comic Hugh Fink.”

I’m a little troubled by the fact that it’s going to be produced by Conway Cliff, who also produces the loudmouth proto-fascist ignoramus eel Glenn Beck. Is this going to be yet another right-wing crankfest? I’m pretty sure that market is saturated.

On the other hand, if CNN tries to be “safe” and middle-of-the-road, the bigger risk is just being unfunny. I doubt anybody wants to tune in to a half-hour reel of comedic mediocrity.

But like H.L. Mencken said, “No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.”

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Quotes, frogs and blogs.

March 1, 2008

Some of you might have gotten here by way of link from the comic’s comic. A few days ago, its author, Sean McCarthy, posted on that site about the similarity between the name of this blog and Dead-Frog.com, a site run by Todd Jackson. Both Todd and I reference the line by E.B. White quoted above, a well-known quip that frequently gets tossed around when people talk about humor.

Sean’s tone seemed a bit sharper than the situation called for, so I sent him an email asking him to dial it back a little. I explained myself, pointing out that I had Googled the phrase “killing frogs,” and nobody was using it in connection with a comedy blog. I hadn’t seen nor heard of Todd’s site before I picked the name, and White’s humor quote has been part of the public sphere since 1941, when he published his book on the subject, A Subtreasury of American Humor. As an academic, being accused of plagiarism is a very big deal, even if it’s light-hearted. Sean was kind enough to post an explanation, and I appreciate that.

I also contacted Todd, and assured him that I have no desire or intention to step on his toes. He has earned a good reputation with his website, and he deserves to keep it. The site is very impressive and very professional, with Todd’s musings, industry news, reviews, discussion forums, and ads for comedy goods and services. It’s no geek-with-a-modem-and-an-ax-to-grind blog.

Which is where I come in. My interest in this blog is purely academic. Ironically, I started it to avoid having my ideas usurped in the academic field. I study satire as a cultural phenomenon and talk publicly about my research quite a bit, so getting my words into print somewhere is the only way I can be assured of getting proper credit for ideas I’ve developed. It’s kind of childish, but that’s academia for you.

Stylistically and substantively, Todd’s website and this blog could hardly be more different. All that links them is a shared general topic and the White quote. I think reasonable folks would agree, anyone who would confuse Todd’s site with this little dog-and-pony show has no business using the internet unsupervised.

Nevertheless, Todd explained that he earns a living with his site, which he started in June of 2004, and asked if I might consider changing the name of this blog.  He, understandably, wants to keep the cache he’s built up with his site, and thought there might be some leakage with my site.

I gave it a lot of thought. He asked nicely, not making demands or threats and being reasonable, and I don’t want to take money out of another writer’s pocket. (For the record, I don’t intend or expect to make one red cent from these postings.) Still, many of my friends in the comedy world and the academic world have been kind enough to link to this blog, and I’ve gotten a fair amount of traffic. I didn’t want to have to contact all of them again and ask them to change the links that they had been kind enough to put up in the first place. I think the look and content of our sites are very, very different.  And I really like the White quote.

So I called my old pal Crimmins. Barry Crimmins has been around the comedy world for more than 35 years, and as the founder of Boston’s Ding Ho comedy club was notorious for his merciless approach to joke thieves. I figured he would help me clear up my thinking.

Barry’s short answer was, “Fuck it. Change it. What do you care? Who are these people? Why do you have to deal with this?” (If you know Barry, it’s always best to picture him aggravatedly rubbing his forehead when you read his quotes. It just feels right.)

I explained to him the situation and assured him I wanted to do the right thing, but that I was having a philosophical discussion with myself about what, exactly, the right thing was. “Dead frog” is different from “killing frogs.” A professional, commercial website is different from a pissant blog. Neither of us could legitimately claim intellectual right to a quote that’s been part of the public conversation for nearly 70 years.

As we talked, Crimmins wanted to see the sites we were discussing. I told him about the original post on the comic’s comic. He asked, “Which one?” Googling the phrase “comics comic” had turned up a page of variants, including comicscomicsmag.blogspot.com, which Barry had confused with thecomicscomic.typepad.com. Easy mistake, I suppose, with coincidentally similar-named blogs….

He then wanted to see Todd’s site, so I told him to go to “dead frog dot com.” Which he did. “What is this? What is he talking about?” he asked incredulously. I asked, “Dead hyphen frog dot com?” “No,” says he, “deadfrog dot com.”

A little research finds that deadfrog.com was created in 1999. Not to be confused with deadfrog.net (created 1996), deadfrog.us (copyright 2004), and certainly not deadfrogrecords.com (created 2001) or johnny-come-lately deadfrogbrewery.com (created 2006).  The point is not to cast any aspersions on Todd, but to show that there are a lot of site names more similar to his than mine.  So the accusation (which did not come from Todd) was, in my opinion, unfair and gratuitous.

I’ve now had a few days to discuss this with Crimmins and some other comics and writers whose opinions I value. I want to give Todd a fair shake. I’m not here to ride anybody’s coattails or pick anyone’s pocket.

The controversy over joke-jacking (well reported by Larry Getlen at Radar) and who owns a bit, and whether you can own a premise, Cook vs. C.K., Mencia vs. Rogan, Leary vs. Hicks, etc., etc., all play into my thinking. I don’t want to be the guy who lifted Todd’s “bit.”

At the same time, I have strong feelings about free speech and intellectual property and who owns words and ideas and concepts and what happens when you surrender your rights. If I change my blog name, am I tacitly accepting Todd’s “ownership” of the White quote? And what does it mean if I do? So my interest in this is bigger than merely changing the name or not. Clearly, I’m thinking too much about this.

What do you think?

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Update 03/05/08: In the end, I decided to keep the name.  I have no hard feelings about this situation or against Todd, who was a gentleman throughout this whole procedure, which was not fun for either of us I’m sure.  I respect Todd and the things he does on his website, and I recommend you read it regularly.  We’re doing different things, and he does his thing well.  I’m just giving my pissant two cents on the goings on that affect my research interest.  You ask me what’s happening in the world of comedy, I’m going to send you to Todd at Dead-Frog.com.